The following is an auto-generated transcript of the season 1 finale of the Ontario First Nations Technically Speaking Podcast.

00:05 - Chelsey (Host)
Welcome back to Technically Speaking. This is Chelsea Johnson, your host, and today I am coming at you from the Thunder Bay office of OFN TSD. Today we're going to be speaking with Darko Dimitrijevic.

00:21 - Darko (Guest)
Perfect.

00:22 - Chelsey (Host)
And he is a project manager here at OFN TSD and he's been with us for a couple of years now. I believe Darko Two years.

00:30 - Darko (Guest)
Four, I want to say three and a half.

00:33 - Chelsey (Host)
Okay, I should know that's awesome. Yeah, so just to start us out, darko, welcome. And yeah, if you could just tell us a little bit about what your role is. What is project management?

00:47 - Darko (Guest)
Sure, sure. Thank you for having me. I was kind of last night I went online and I looked at some podcasts because really I haven't seen them before, I've heard of them. So I expected like cigars and drink, you know, on the table. But I guess we can't do that here. Yeah, what is project management? I guess maybe, first, we should define what a project is. You know, we could say a project is a goal for a desired outcome, right, like perhaps a new facility somewhere, upgrades to a water treatment plant, a survey, a study. I mean, you know there's a lot of different kinds of projects. What is project management? Project management, then, would be like the process of oversight, you know, maybe leadership to achieve your project, right, to make sure it's successful.

01:41 - Chelsey (Host)
Awesome. And then how did you come into this role of being a project manager? Is it something you've always done? Is it a new role that you've taken on, or what's your background like?

01:50 - Darko (Guest)
Well, you know what? I really didn't wake up one day and like I want to be a project manager. I didn't really even know what a project manager was when I was younger, right, so it didn't fall in place. But I mean, that's life, right, nothing you know. You plan on doing something and you end up doing something totally different in life. So, yeah, I'm sure we can all relate to that experience.

02:11
When I was younger, I did a lot of work for municipal and provincial housing agencies. I was, you know, a small general contractor, met a lot of people there and even some people to this day that I still meet with OFN TSC. I think the first contract that I obtained it was for a great fellow by the name of Mike Murchison. He was at that time he was a maintenance manager for Thunder Bay District Housing and, it's funny, but not that long ago here with OFN TSC, I met Councillor Murchison again on a project for one of our UFNs. So it was really neat to see it kind of come full circle, right. Like you know, I first started in, you know, working in the industry and you know, with this fella, and then I'm meeting him now, right, so that was really kind of cool.

03:07
So, anyways, back to how I am where I am here, I gravitated to maybe like larger contracts and larger work for for a lot of federal agencies, right, I did some projects with that time. They were INAC, indigenous, northern Affairs, canada, some other agencies, canada Border Services, you know. So I did a lot of projects for them, right, like a lot of contracts, sorry. And what had happened was these federal agencies, the government, moved towards property management groups, right, so they had, you know, one property management group that would look after all of the different departments with regards to maintenance, or you know, construction projects, right, so they had, you know, one property management group that would look after all of the different departments with regards to maintenance, or you know construction projects, right.

03:50
So I found myself managing some of these projects, right, for these property management groups, yeah, and even then the people that I've met, you know, at INAC, then I've bumped into now, right, like it always comes full circle, right, and I'm always telling you know, at INAC, then I've bumped into now, right, like it always comes full, full circle, right, and I'm always telling my son, like don't be a jerk, you know what I mean to that person, because you will, you will, you will work with them again, you will meet. So just you know, don't be a jerk. I guess it's the advice I give to my son. Don't burn bridges too, right? Yes, no, totally, totally. I mean it's not just about networking, but don't burn that bridge. I mean that's huge. So yeah, I did that for quite a few decades. And then I seen a posting with OFN TSC, right for project management. They were looking for a project manager and I thought, well, you know what great. And here I am like with you, and here I am like with you, that's awesome.

04:44 - Chelsey (Host)
And I have to say, darko, you have great people skills, is that? Something that you no, no, no, no, well is it something that you find you have in this role. It helps out having, you know, good interpersonal relationships.

05:00 - Darko (Guest)
I wouldn't say I have good speaking skills because I don't Like I've broken down in front of people. Like you know I'm going home, but I guess. So maybe I try and make up with people. Skills like if that makes makes sense, Right, Like you know you, naturally everyone wants to be liked, Right? So so you want to work well with people to try and be liked if that makes any sense. I don't know. Yeah.

05:26 - Chelsey (Host)
And so you kind of it seems like you know you kind of had a bunch of experiences working on various projects of various sizes and then fell into kind of this specific project manager type of title role. But like, is there any kind of like educational background that you think you would need to have?

05:45 - Darko (Guest)
Well, I mean, you know any engineering background. Of course it's a huge asset. In the late 80s, I guess, I enrolled in Confederation College here in their civil program, graduated I think it was 1990s. I kind of gave away my age there, but yeah, so I finished the program here and then I kind of jumped right into construction, right, Like it's always been a passion for me to see something from start to finish, right, something created it, just yeah, I love being involved in that process.

06:25
At the end of this month we have a grand opening for a new school at one of our ufns and, uh, everyone on that project team was passionate about the project, right, we wanted it to succeed and it will. I mean it, it did. The grand opening is at the end of this month, so I'll probably wear like dark sunglasses, right, because you know you work with people for like that long. You get a project done and then when it's done especially a school, right, so then I'll wear glasses in case I get tears of joy or something, so people don't see me Well finally seeing all those years of work.

07:01
Oh yeah.

07:02 - Chelsey (Host)
Come to fruition.

07:03 - Darko (Guest)
For sure.

07:07 - Chelsey (Host)
Yeah, seeing all those years of work, oh yeah, come to fruition for sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So you mentioned the school, um, but what are the types of projects that you work on here at OFNTSC? I know you're within the engineering department, so do you have kind of a hand in all of the projects or specific ones?

07:21 - Darko (Guest)
well, um, there's about five projects that I'm involved with that I'm directly the project manager with. Right, like you know, I'm basically keeping track of the schedule, budget tracking and that kind of stuff. We don't have an outside project manager that's overlooking it. Right, that's running it, so to speak. So there's about five that I'm directly involved with, you know. One of the smaller ones would be we have an emergency mapping system that we're creating like a rural route system, numbering for some addresses. And one of the larger ones would be we're looking after a fire hall retrofit for one of our remote UFNs. Wow, yeah, there's, of course, you course, much larger projects, right, like the school that I mentioned, a few other new builds for fire halls and stuff like that nature where we are still providing a technical service role. We're on the project team but we're not leading as project managers. We've got outside professional project managers that we've helped outside professional project managers. That that we've, you know, helped, you know, pray a cure for the, for the communities.

08:29 - Chelsey (Host)
So I know last was it last year, the year before you had done uh, the training, the project management training that you guys facilitated. But I'm just curious, because we run a lot of events in the communications department. We have our big tech nations conference, we have have a golf tournament, we have events all throughout the year. What are some like project management go to? I guess like stages. What are the stages that like we could help us when our planning?

08:56 - Darko (Guest)
Well, I guess if you're kind of asking like the start of a project, you know if it's a new facility, you of course would work with the community maybe to develop a charter, right. Like you know your common goals, you know oftentimes for certain projects you funding for a feasibility study, when you're talking about a school, you know you'd, you'd, you'd want to know a lot of data right before you can even get a shovel and ground right projection, enrollments, population projections, stuff like like of that nature, right. So so that would be definitely the start, funding, funding. Funding is always, you know, a very important one tough tough one.

09:44
Well, even before budgeting, you know, just to seek the funding, right, you know, for the for your project, you know we often help our communities like with cost, like cost estimates right. Like you know, before we need we can, can seek this funding, we need an estimated cost, right. So we'd, you know we'd reach out to our consultants that we work with, or even contractors to, to get an idea of costing. Um, so those, those would kind of be the initial initial steps, right. And then, once those are approved, you, you know, you you can get into uh procurement stages right, for either a professional project manager or or, or, you know, a design team, and then, uh, you know, work your way to getting a contractor on board and yeah yeah and uh like so here at OFN TSC.

10:30 - Chelsey (Host)
Um, you're, you're here as a project manager. What are the uh, the benefits that you can bring to a community using our project management services versus maybe trying to manage a project on their own?

10:44 - Darko (Guest)
Well, I mean, you know there's all kinds of benefits to having our team here work, you know, with the community, you know creating a project team.

10:59
I guess you know a lot of these communities have brilliant, brilliant administrators, right, super intelligent people that work in the band offices, right, it just becomes like a lot of these individuals wear many hats, right, like you have a housing manager, right, and then he's also acting as the finance manager for the community, you know, and he could also be working at the water treatment plant. Perhaps he's a counselor too, right? So when you, you know ask them to, in essence, take, you know, run a project, or, you know, act as a project manager for an important project in the community, you know fully capable, but literally they are overworked, right, like you know. So I think that, of course, is a huge benefit of getting, you know ourselves involved, you know, at OF&TSC, or you know, a paid professional project manager, so there's some benefit there, right? And experience, you know our engineering team here. I wouldn't even venture to guess how many successful projects we've been involved with. You know hundreds, if not thousands now, like. So, you know, you, the community gets that experience too, right?

12:14 - Chelsey (Host)
So for sure. That's awesome. No, that's. That's really great, because I know we do have a lot of projects on the go and how do you? Keep track of them, Darko.

12:23 - Darko (Guest)
You know what, honestly, sometimes I'm a hot mess. Right Like just you get a week of being bombarded with emails and you know so you really can't. You know, and so, but again, if it's something you enjoy, if you're passionate about, you'll find time to organize it right. You know to keep track of.

12:43 - Chelsey (Host)
You know how do you cultivate that?

12:45 - Darko (Guest)
passion, enjoying it. Well, I'm sure someday it'll fade, but keeping track of it. It's like Tricia, you know from our office, our senior engineer. She's done a great job with our internal hard drive right. She, you know organizing projects and everything. She's set templates, she's put a lot of work into it. So I mean that is it's kind of been very handy for myself in keeping information tracked right.

13:18 - Chelsey (Host)
That has to be. A huge bonus is just being organized.

13:19 - Darko (Guest)
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. And, like I said, sometimes I I do struggle with that right and then I get on top of it and then you get hit with another wave and you're struggling again, but such, yeah, it's just the way it goes no for sure.

13:33 - Chelsey (Host)
Like are there any specific resources or tools that you guys use? Like I know, uh, we have something called asana, but it's not, it's not super extensive. Like, do you guys have a software that you use to manage projects?

13:44 - Darko (Guest)
Well, we don't, but I shouldn't say we don't, because Drew has set up some software that we're looking at now to help with the organization of files and all of that stuff. You know the budget tracking, the scheduling, like you know a lot of software, that stuff. You know the budget tracking, the scheduling, like you know a lot of software that'll assist us with that. I will, of course, have to play along as best I can, but maybe I'm a bit of a dinosaur and I don't want to change something that's working now. But yeah, so our director, drew Hill, is definitely pushing us towards that. So, yeah, we'll give that a shot.

14:23 - Chelsey (Host)
And so you know. You mentioned how you have the one project coming to a close very soon. I think that was the new school. Yeah yeah, what's the process for if a community wanted to get help with a project?

14:39 - Darko (Guest)
Reach out to us. You know I think yourself and Lucas have done a lot of work on our web page. You know I'm sure they can get anyone from our communities can get a hold of any of us, or I mean simply just to put more work back to our directors. But just reach out to them, you know, send them an email and then they will. You know, they'll get some information from you, I would imagine, about your project, or you know what the desire is. Would imagine about your project, or or or you know what the desire is and uh, then they'll. You know they'll reach out to uh someone in uh, you know our various departments to uh work with them. So I I guess reach out.

15:15 - Chelsey (Host)
The website would probably be the uh best place to um, yeah, and well, since you have that project coming to close, um like is that the end of it, or is there work that you have to do after as well, um, you know for for for that project.

15:28 - Darko (Guest)
Really, I don't think I will be involved too much afterwards, right? You know, for any new facility that's built, you know it doesn't end as soon as the you know doors are open and it's put into use. Usually there's like a standard commissioning and warranty phase, right, that usually lasts about a year, right, so you know the community, the owners, will have that one year to reach back to the project team. Usually the consultants are held on board. Still, you know, oftentimes they don't get their final you know payments or hold back until that process is fully completed, right, so that's the case for a school. I mean, we've got other projects like water treatment plants. You know like they're, you know when they're completed. It's definitely OFNTSC is not gone, right, we stay on board, for you know all the training that we provide, or our hub team or circuit rider.

16:24 - Chelsey (Host)
Yeah, like once the treatment plant finishes it gets kind of handed over to the CRTP hub program.

16:28 - Darko (Guest)
Yeah, so we're treatment plant finishes, it gets handed over to the CRTP Hub program. Yeah, so I guess it would depend on the project, right? You know some projects we would definitely stay on board for quite a length of time after its physical completion, right?

16:38 - Chelsey (Host)
So yeah, using that school as an example, like would that be something that would eventually become on Elmer and Dean's radar because they're in asset management?

16:48 - Darko (Guest)
Oh, it very well could be.

16:49 - Chelsey (Host)
Yeah, so that becomes, an asset in the community that then they have to 100%. Yeah.

16:54 - Darko (Guest)
And Chelsea. Yeah, I guess I could have, and should have brought that up too. I mean, I'm fairly certain our office assists with, you know, the mandatory acres reports, right? Yes, so you know, that, of course, is like you say is an asset. So down the road I'm sure at one point are you know we would assist them with completing ACRS reports also.

17:14 - Chelsey (Host)
It's just crazy to me how our services are. They overlap each other and work together. And yeah, it always just blows my mind how much we do here at OFNTSC. What is the typical? You know like size of a project that you would handle.

17:28 - Darko (Guest)
see, what is the typical, you know, like size of a project that you would handle. Well, again, you know I kind of alluded to earlier, like with the smaller project that you know that I mentioned being a community address mapping, right, you know the rural route numbers that you see outside. We've assisted with that. That would be a small. If you want to talk about monetary, like you know that I think that project was about monetary, like you know, I think that project was, I think, $25,000, right. And then you know we run into bigger ones. I guess the biggest one currently that I'm lead on would be just almost a million and a half for a retrofit for a fire hall. And then there's much bigger projects that we're a part of but we're not directly the lead on it, right? So there's definitely some multimillion dollar infrastructure projects that, like water treatment plants, that our engineering team is assisting with.

18:19 - Chelsey (Host)
It seems like you have to know kind of a lot about a lot. You know like in terms of like the numbering of the houses and then retrofitting a fire hall and then also constructing a water treatment plant at school, like are all the projects kind of similar in the same steps?

18:34 - Darko (Guest)
Well, the process really is the same. You know the steps, the steps of engagement. You know with the community, with the team building a team. You know engaging with funding agents, engaging with the community and all the stakeholders. So the processes are the same, moving forward, even though the project can be vastly different. But the general stages of a project still are the same or very similar. So I'm assisting with the project team for a water treatment plant. I could not tell you a lot of the technical details of a water treatment plant, but that's why we have, you know, amy, that's why we have Tricia, that's you know. So I think we'll complement each other there.

19:24 - Chelsey (Host)
Yeah, for sure, and you know, having had all these years of experience doing these projects, what's your best advice to communities who are even just looking to stay on top of managing their own projects?

19:37 - Darko (Guest)
I guess maybe the best advice I can give there is community is managing their own project. You know you can talk about, like I said, the scheduling, the budget, tracking and all those responsibilities, but I think the best advice I would give if they're managing their own project is to stay on top of the communication, right, like what I've experienced is when the communication breaks down, like within a project team, the project's going to fail, like it. Just once that communication stops, the project will fail. So. So keep everybody involved. Right, be that persistent project manager that that will keep people engaged.

20:19
If if a community has an outside project manager involved in one of their projects, then what I would recommend is, during your project team meetings, you know when you're sitting down with the engineers, the architects, you know even the contractors. When you're the consultants, when you're sitting down as a team with them, ask questions. Like you know it's your community, right? You own the project, not the engineers that you're sitting in these meetings with. So ask questions, ask a lot of questions, the project manager that you have on board leading these team meetings. It is their responsibility to make sure you understand, right, like so often, you'll see a lot of these acronyms being thrown around and you see the big. I's right.

21:09
And even I'm lost half the time, like okay, so I've got to look up what does that acronym mean? Right? But a lot of times that's what happens is the questions aren't asked. So ask those questions? Yeah, that's what meetings are really for. In a lot of these project team meetings is to make sure everyone's on board, engaged, involved, and that starts with asking questions. So that would be, I guess, my biggest advice is ask the questions For sure.

21:34 - Chelsey (Host)
Well, it sounds like you have a very, you know, diverse and fun, albeit sometimes probably very stressful role here at OFN TSC, but it sounds like it's very rewarding role here at OFNTSC, but it sounds like it's very rewarding.

21:51 - Darko (Guest)
Oh, it is Like stressful, yeah, but there's, every job has stress, you know. For someone to say, you know, oh, look, his job's easy, he's no stress. Every job, everyone has stress. But what I will say, like there's been quite a few communities now that I've, you know, been to and engaged with, very rewarding. Yeah, I've been very well received and welcomed with a lot of the communities that we work with, so that offsets the stress, you know, it's very rewarding there.

22:18 - Chelsey (Host)
Well, as somebody who has a lot more experience than I do handling stress, do you have any tips for me personally?

22:24 - Darko (Guest)
I don't know. I don't know. I really yeah, Because sometimes I can feel it like weighing on me a little bit, but it's, you know, it is the knowledge of the work at times, right? You know, if you're doing something over and over and over for a month straight, I think, maybe then go back to your family, right? Spend a little time with family, work-life balance, type of thing. Yeah for sure. Yeah, awesome For sure.

23:00 - Chelsey (Host)
Cool, Darko. Well, thank you so much for sitting down with us and chatting everything. Project management.

23:07 - Darko (Guest)
You're welcome.

23:09 - Chelsey (Host)
It's something that I think it can apply to a lot of different areas.

23:13 - Darko (Guest)
Oh, for sure.

23:14 - Chelsey (Host)
You know, everyone kind of is managing many projects at different scales, right, even in other types of roles. So, yeah, really interesting to have you on and thank you so much.

23:26
Appreciate it for having me here, guys great well, thank you everyone for listening to today's episode. As always, you can find us at ofntscorg, as darko was mentioning. Please check it out if you want to get in touch with anyone here to learn more about how we can help you out with your projects in your communities. Definitely do reach out to us and until next time, take care.